Responses to New Vegan Market Will Return to Guildford High Street

1. John Armstrong Reply

   August 12, 2019 at 6:56 pm

   I was fascinated to read the article by Hugh Coakley covering the recent Vegan Market in Guildford.

   A lot of people of course will be wanting to do their bit for the climate having been subjected to generated climate emergency hysteria from elected politicians, who should by now be more cautious about fake news and hyperbole.

   When it comes to a vegan cake, for example; one might think, yummy; and one might feel holier than thou for buying a vegan cake, but it is still a cake and it is still fattening. In fact the only parts of the cake that were not fattening or indeed were any good for you at all nutritionally, the milk and the eggs, have been removed and replaced with substitutes which are fattening.

   Remember also, that some food manufactures will be jumping on the climate band wagon and selling us vegan this and that which will no doubt cost more, sharp and stony ground they will calculate, that we will stoically traverse in bare feet to feel even holier. And we will feed it to our children and say, eat this my child for it is a vegan cake and by dint good for you, the hand of morality is upon it, and the diabetes epidemic will pass to the next generation.

   I blame vegetarians and vegans for the type 2 diabetes epidemic that is costing society so much. They have been discouraging us from eating meat for decades. As a result we have been eating more cheap carbohydrates and carbohydrates are seen by the metabolism as suger and some may remember that type 2 diabetes used to be known as sugar diabetes.

   I would caution any who are thinking of going vegi or vegan. Do proper research, it’s all on the net. You cannot just go vegi or vegan overnight because your digestion will have to adjust. You will most likely have to take dietary supplements and you will have to pay attention to everything that you eat. You will probably have to buy more and better loo rolls and have a mind to your methane production; don’t smoke in the loo. Seriously; either the cows do the methane or we do.

   In fact I would ban these belief-based diets for growing children. If adults want to do it that’s up to them; but children don’t have the choice.

   Finally. Even herbivores are not vegetarians. It took humanity to think that one up. I blame the Cerebral Cortex; it thinks too much.
   .
   https://medium.com/a-microbiome-scientist-at-large/how-does-a-1-200-pound-cow-get-enough-pr
   • Jules Cranwell Reply

     August 13, 2019 at 2:00 pm

     I’m sorry, but most of this is nonsense. Being vegan does not mean that one lives on cake. I’m sure there were many more savoury and healthy options on offer.
     Mr Armstrong will soon discover that the production of animal protein is a luxury the earth can no longer afford, and it will have to soon end, if the human race is to survive.
     I’ve been vegetarian for over 50 years, eat no carbs, and am completely healthy, much more so than many of my peers who are meat eaters.
     There is no evidence that vegans produce any more methane than anyone else.
     There is also a moral dimension to this. What gives us the right to kill defenceless animals, unnecessarily, for our consumption?
     Speak to any doctor or nutritionist, and they’ll tell you that excessive meat consumption is a less than healthy choice.
     I am by no means a militant veggie, who goes around scowling into butchers’ shops, and do not lecture my pals on the evils of meat consumption.
   • Harry Eve Reply

     August 14, 2019 at 11:22 am

     A fascinating response from John Armstrong. As a vegetarian for over thirty years, I can say that I had no difficulty adjusting, and the occasional tummy bugs that I experienced as a meat-eater became a distant memory. Dietary supplements were unnecessary, I am in excellent health as far as I am aware and touch wood this will continue (preferably FSC certified). Regarding the other points made – I can confirm that I am not a ruminant (relevant to methane production) and although I am a non-smoker it would appear that those who do smoke should also avoid doing so near cows (I was not previously aware of this).
   • Gloria Bartholomew Reply

     August 14, 2019 at 6:44 pm

     Wow such an interesting perspective. You’ve convinced me!

     I’m ready to chow down on the rotting flesh of a dead cow again. I have actually been spending too much money on toilet roll recently. Reverting back to a meat based diet will allow me to get clogged up and struggle to pass my motions thus solving that particular problem! I have a few good books I would like to start reading so can start spending more time in the bathroom really straining.

     I will be sure to remember your general message that cake is bad. I’ll tell my diabetic father to make sure that if he does choose to eat it, then not to be fooled by those pesky vegans and think he can have a double helping of vegan choccie brownie. That said, he actually eats meat so maybe won’t need that reminder as it’s unlikely he is as cerebrally challenged as those pesky vegans.

     Must dash… still have 25 vitamin supplements to take and the day is nearly over
   • Shelley Eugene Reply

     August 14, 2019 at 10:18 pm

     I would love to respond but I am just laughing too much
2. Jack Brown Reply

   August 13, 2019 at 9:08 am

   It was disappointing that so much space was given to a comment so inaccurate. John says, do your research its all on the net so I wonder how he has missed the many articles claiming that vegi/vegan diets can lower cholesterol, heart disease, and yes diabetes. In fact figures show those on these diets have less incidences of diabetes.

   As to his comments about how vegis/vegans eat cake full of carbohydrates and this has caused the epidemic, it is rather condescending and assumes a superior intelligence.

   Like anyone on any diet some choose to eat healthily and some choose what they want rather than what is perhaps best and surely everyone deserves an occasional treat. By his thinking everyone who eats meat is trim and healthy and does not have diabetes which we know is not true. Meat eaters stuff themselves with cake (non vegan) to and other junk food to the extent that we have an obesity crisis in this country which is not fuelled by vegans eating vegan cake who are not bright enough to work out it has carbs in it! Give people some credit!

   It is NOT most likely that supplements will be needed either. Again it is up to the individual to choose from the wide variety of nutritional food that is now available and thanks to events like the vegan market now becoming more widely available. Such events also provide more awareness of the different types of nutrients available naturally in food so that supplements are not needed.

   Rather than being a belief based diet, most vegi and vegans are on the diet for improved health or because they disagree with the way farm animals are treated these days. Like anything some people might take it too far but that would be true of meat eaters and the general population anyway.

   It is good that the choice is being put out there so people can choose for themselves.

   If he does not agree with being vegan, surely all he needs to do is what vegans do with regards butchers shops – don’t visit!
3. Keith Francis Reply

   August 14, 2019 at 6:54 am

   I met a man who is a vegan for health not fad reasons eating his regular full English breakfast as that provides him with nutrition that the diet doesnt.
4. Lisa South Reply

   August 14, 2019 at 6:04 pm

   I think you are misinformed John, dairy and eggs are not nutritious or healthy, in fact dairy has been linked to breast and prostate cancer amongst other illnesses. There is a myth that has been sold by the industries that we need milk for strong bones, again this is untrue.

   Type 2 diabetes can be reversed following a whole foods plant based diet and sadly you are making a sweeping judgement that all the cakes at the market contain sugar or are worse than non-vegan cakes.

   What is causing diabetes is all the junk food with hidden sugar and fat. The reason people are becoming obese is the amount of fast food chains and ready meals available. Don’t even get me started on heart disease and the amount of fat and cholesterol in animal products.

   It is now scientifically proven that following a balanced, whole foods plant based diet is better for your health, the planet and of course the animals.

   No animal needs to suffer for humans to thrive. Children do have a choice, many don’t want to eat animals. A friends daughter at 5 years old made the decision and her family supported her and also turned to a vegan lifestyle. Feeding children processed foods and meats is far more damaging.

   I feel you need to do your research. People are getting sick, the planet is suffering and animals are being abused and suffering all because society has led us to believe we need to consume animals to survive. We are not cave men, we have supermarkets now. We are also not physiologically designed to digest rotting corpses.

   I could go on and on…. but sadly I feel my breath will be wasted.
5. Jackie Samson Reply

   August 14, 2019 at 6:21 pm

   Diabetes rates are lowest in vegans and vegetarians. That is a fact, so I am really not sure how you can even argue that vegetarians are to blame for increased diabetes levels.

   No one is saying that vegan cakes are healthy – they are advertised as vegan cakes, not as healthy. Vegans are allowed to eat unhealthy food if they want to – it’s a free country!

   All of these stalls in this market are small, independent businesses.

   Also – how is feeding a child a vegan diet any less of a choice for the child than feeding them meat? How many times do you tell children that what they’re eating is the animals that they see in the fields? My questions on this subject were certainly avoided when I was a child.

   I think you are the one who’s cerebral cortex is over-thinking my friend. Let people enjoy their vegan cake.
6. Lisa South Reply

   August 14, 2019 at 6:30 pm

   Sadly John you seem very misguided and perhaps are unaware that times have changed and we don’t need meat to survive or thrive. You also seem to disbelieve that climate change is real.

   Did you not know that animals such as cows are given supplements such as B12? These animals are pumped full of drugs and hormones too… dairy and eggs are hardly the healthy part of a cake, full of fat, cholesterol, hormones and pus… hardly the wiser choice.

   You are assuming people feed their children cake, and also you speak of choice, when actually we often push our beliefs that we need to eat animals to survive, a complete myth, we are not cavemen John.

   Most of us in our hearts are born vegan, because we are against animal suffering.

   Society has made it normal, but in the future (if we have one) this will change.

   Only the other day a friend’s daughter told her parents she didn’t want to eat animals. Stories like this I hear more and more, she’s aged five, and with the full support of her family, they have all transitioned to a vegan lifestyle.

   If slaughter houses had glass walls noone would eat the pain and suffering they unknowingly pay others to do.

   Equally not all cakes are full of sugar or other such ingredients you seem to imply are worse for you and causing type 2 diabetes . In fact eating a whole foods plant based diet can actually reverse type 2 diabetes. Would it also surprise you further to find out that a beef burger will spike insulin. Not to mention the other side effects of eating rotting corpses (because all meat is processed), heart disease and cancer are the biggest killers world wide.

   There are many health issues associated with animal products and whilst I agree vegan junk food is not healthy, plant based food is a lot healthier than animal products. Balance and moderation when consuming sweet treats, although every supermarket or shop you go to is full of dairy, eggs and sugar laden food, so I hardly feel the vegan food is to blame.

   Regarding the issue of methane – you do realise that cows burp and fart it and even if you suggest vegans excrete more they no where near pump into the atmosphere the levels of methane gas as from a huge cow. Personally, I haven’t eaten meat for 22 years and I am strong and healthy and I don’t have any bowel problems.

   Your link doesn’t work but perhaps you would care to read this one or visit the market to find out more and dispel some myths over a sugar free, healthy sweet treat or a raw food salad.

   https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2367646/
   • John Armstrong Reply

     August 16, 2019 at 5:52 pm

     I thank Lisa South for her reply.

     I was not aware that my link didn’t work. It went on to say that – Even herbivores are not vegetarians.

     Apparently a 1,500lb lactating cow digests 6½lb of microbial protein a day for which it must eat 56lb of dry matter.

     For a beef cow feeding growth rather than milk production the figures may be different.

     The point remains that herbivorous are in fact carnivorous once removed; and that growing biological tissue be it animal or human needs animal protein for growth and it probably grows at the same rate given input for output and work in between.

     1,500lb is about the same weight as nine 12-stone people. I wonder if the collective effluvia of such would match the cow? We could eat 56lb of vegi between us, microbial activity notwithstanding. That’s about 6lb each and we would of course place the gas spectrometer down wind.

     Climate change: I doubt humanity has anything to do with it. Even if it were so it would reach a point of equilibrium; it will not become like Venus.

     To try and reverse warming, our government is set to spend £1 trillion just to make Britain an example.

     Thirty or so years of flagellation just to virtue signal to the rest of the world and hope that they follow suit; that is hardly an emergency.

     Yet elected politicians are creating panic.

     Teenage girls are suffering anxiety and wringing their hands, people are deciding not to have children because of the bleak outlook.

     For crying out loud.
7. Justin Dix Reply

   August 14, 2019 at 6:41 pm

   I work in the NHS. Believe me a western meat and dairy based diet is the cause of diabetes and the epidemic of gastric-intestinal disorders. Plant based diets extend life, no question. And by the way it’s an evidence based diet not a belief based diet, and we are killing and harming more children over time with meat and dairy foods than ever …
   • John Perkins Reply

     August 16, 2019 at 11:46 am

     Nothing to do with excess sugar in processed food, then?
8. Lisa sturley Reply

   August 14, 2019 at 7:09 pm

   Thank you John Armstrong for your well-worn stereotypical unfounded/researched views on veganism. It has done us all a great favour by opening up a discussion so that the true facts about veganism can be passed on. We are all so used to being challenged put down and ostracized, it’s water off a duck’s back, but now people are being educated about the real reason that veganism is on the rise in prolific numbers and how easy it is to change your diet to even incorporate small changes that will make big changes to your health, the planet and most of all to stop the suffering of animals. There is no difference between your family pet and a factory farmed animal kept in appalling conditions with a painful existence/death. They are all sentient beings with pain receptors and emotions. They should all be treated the same .
9. Lisa Sturley Reply

   August 14, 2019 at 10:53 pm

   Thank you John Armstrong for your well worn stereotypical unfounded / researched views on veganism.

   It has done us all a great favour by opening up a discussion so that the true facts about veganism can be passed on.

   We are all so used to being challenged, put down and ostracised, it’s water off a duck’s back.

   But now people are being educated on the real reason veganism is on the rise in prolific numbers, and how easy it is to change your diet to even incorporate small changes that will make big changes to your health, the planet, and most of all to stop the suffering of animals.

   There is no difference between your family pet and a factory farmed animal kept in appalling conditions with a painful existence / death – they are all sentient beings with pain receptors and emotions and they should all be treated the same.
10. jim Allen Reply

    August 15, 2019 at 9:19 am

    Interesting comments… The Inuit diet is 99% meat and they seem perfectly healthy to me… Personally I’m tired of forcible demands of ‘you can’t eat this because…. you can’t drink that because’ – My Grandfather never heard of Veganism, it hadn’t been invented while he was alive….and lived to over 90 years old. He was told if he didn’t stop smoking and drinking in 1904 he would die a young man…. he died the morning after his last fag and last whiskey at 91 years old… but what would he know how bad his diet was, after all it was classic ‘English’ all his life my grand mother didn’t know anything different..
    • Harry Eve Reply

      August 15, 2019 at 1:19 pm

      I am not making forcible demands on anyone but I did expect a contribution to the discussion along these lines.

      I would like to add the following: https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2013/12/18/inuit_life_expectancy_lags_as_rest_of_canada_living_longer.html
    • BT Smith Reply

      August 16, 2019 at 9:17 pm

      Evening Jim,

      Do you know many inuits ;D I’m being facetious of course, but just thought I’d chime in that Inuits actually have a life expectancy significantly lower than the rest of Canada, about 12 years less. You could say that life up there is a lot more brutal than say Vanouver, but similarly there is a lot less pollution. So swings & roundabouts eh.

      My point is that picking and choosing at will can be used to strengthen any point of view. Similarly, picking out individuals is not a good indication of the healthiness of a lifestyle. My dad died at 55 from lung cancer. I would not use that to argue that everyone who smokes will die at 55 because that would simply be selective use of data to disprove actual evidence.

      A meat free diet is though scientifically proven to have significant health benefits, despite those hardy souls who defy the odds! Even just cutting meat out a few times a week is actually very beneficial for our health (especially processed meat). As you rightly say though it’s up to each of us to choose how we live our lives.

      And I fully agree on your last point. I imagine there’s a fair few of us whose mothers smoked/drank during pregnancy etc as the science just simply wasn’t known. Simply a different time. However, the science on all this is very strong now and I personally think it’s important to use it when we make public statements. Have a good evening, however you choose to spend it! : )
      • jim Allen Reply

        August 19, 2019 at 3:13 pm

        Life expectancy of Intuits! That was just a case in point. They have no option of fresh vegetables, they simply don’t grow that far north of the Arctic circle. Perhaps it is in their DNA to live shorter lives as there is insufficient food for too many of them to exist at one time at those latitudes! Anyone can pick a theme should they choose!

        As for forcible demands – has anyone been to the doctors recently? Latest fad of the year is being ‘pre-diabetic’. 20 years ago, everyone was diagnosed with irritable bowl. So now you can’t eat carbohydrates (not sure what they taste like), no fruit juice as too much sugar, no meat as with this column, nothing with palm oil because of deforestation and there are no whales left, so no whale oil. No caffeine and no salt, no milk due to high CO2 emissions of cows (what about the buffalo!)….have I missed anything – the demands not to eat are endless!

        Who knows why people fall off the perch at 55 or 105? Perhaps its just the 105 year old has saved his heart beats while the 55 year old had double the heart rate!

        Thank goodness we have The Dragon to express our differing views.

        PS are you permitted to eat dragons or are they an endangered species?
11. Valerie Thompson Reply

    August 15, 2019 at 6:22 pm

    My father ate everything that was put in front of him.

    He smoked 60 cigarettes a day all the years I knew him, starting his smoking career at 13.

    He survived throat cancer at 82 and an internal bleed at 84 and lived on to 92, still eating the good food his French second wife prepared.

    I do not smoke but certainly never intend to go vegan, vegetarian or on any diet that is not balaced and interesting.

    I love my home-grown vegetables but they are just accompaniments to the meat or fish I cook daily.

    Food should be a pleasure and beans are boring!
    • Shelley Eugene Reply

      August 19, 2019 at 12:17 am

      Why don’t you try a good vegan meal – home cooked or in a restaurant and then talk about “interesting” food ‘cos steak and chips – that’s just so interesting isn’t it?
    • Shelley Eugene Reply

      August 19, 2019 at 12:18 am

      Oh and by the way – we are vegan not necessarily because of being healthy or not – it’s to do with the animals and the environment – give me a bland meal any day if I can save an animal’s life
12. John Armstrong Reply

    August 16, 2019 at 12:08 pm

    I would like to thank all the respondents to my perceptions of the vegan market article. I have to say you are a very civilised lot indeed. I had expected, if anything at all, a black eye and cauliflower ear.

    Diet then. Biochemistry proves I think that one cannot build muscle and bone (this is what children are made of) with a vegetable diet.

    This also is what cows are made of, who, or is it which, have come to an accommodation with their gut bacteria; I think it’s called The Art of The Deal, (thank you Donald) whereby the bacteria can live a life cycle and are able to breed, the cow grows muscle and bone and in due course we eat the cow; everyone gets a life.

    Think if you will of the human fetus. It is totally dependent upon the mother for nutrition. If the mother isn’t eating the right stuff the fetus will take what it needs from the mother, who is also muscle and bone.

    The fetus grows on animal protein and if the mother is not eating animal protein then the fetus will feed upon the mother and cares not a jot for animal welfare.

    Sorry if that offends, but nature is merciless. Many a healthy child has been born to a depleted mother. Mothers need to put their own child before the cow’s calf.

    The thing about animal protein is that you do not need much of it. Unlike carbs which need to be topped up to keep up the blood sugar; elevenses, tea and biscuits round about four. I know it’s nice, cup of tea, few chocolate digestives and a snooze through Columbo or Midsomer Murders, but you’re better off with a chicken drumstick; and you might feel like cutting the grass.

    I began my high protein diet for convenience not politics. I only eat two meals a day and do not eat between meals. No bread, cakes, biscuits. This is not an act of discipline though.

    I do not sit with gritted teeth resisting the well remembered cheese and tomato sandwich, perhaps with a little rocket, I just do not feel like it.

    When it comes to junk food. Bread, potato (chips and mayo excused) rice, any grain, cereal. The worst thing humanity did was farm grain, should have fed it to the cattle or distilled it.

    I would like to see an end to vegi and vegan choices being labelled ‘healthy options’. There is nothing intrinsically healthy about these choices and I think it misleading to label them so.

    I have no problem with people being vegi or vegan until they try to foist it on everyone else and link meat consumption to climate change.

    It has become a religion. It just gives politicians (we know how gullible they are) the opening to tax meat and make it even more difficult for people who may already be using food banks to put a decent meal together.
13. David Roberts Reply

    August 16, 2019 at 3:59 pm

    Most of the above commentary appears to be pseudo-science, and is far too obsessed with selfish questions of personal health as opposed to the sustainability of human existence on Earth, which is now an urgent question.

    Billions of Chinese and Indians are eating meat for the first time, with big consequences.

    I have no intention of turning vegan or vegetarian. Like John Armstrong, I enjoy a high-protein diet. But that is probably because we’re both getting old. It would never have satisfied my 20-year-old self.

    I hope science will eventually supply all the tasty protein varieties that are currently raised so expensively, destructively and inefficiently via animals.

    Many of the arguments used to defend meat-eating today are identical to those used to defend slavery 200 years ago.

    If humans are still around in a hundred years’ time, I am quite sure they will regard eating other sentient beings as disgustingly primitive.
14. BT Smith Reply

    August 16, 2019 at 9:00 pm

    Hiya John, I assume your comments are a wind up (if so you nailed it), but in case not, there is a serious amount of woefully misinformed chatter here that needs correcting. NOTE: I am not vegan. I am also not trying to offend you, I am simply correcting the massive amount of misinformed ‘science’ you are trying to use.

    Firstly John to address your comment,
    ”I have no problem with people being vegi or vegan until they try to foist it on everyone else and link meat consumption to climate change.”

    1. Your comment was the first on the page. It was in fact you foisting your opinion on everyone else (including blaming vegetarians for type 2 diabetes, a diet which is proven to lower the risk of type 2 diabetes by over 20%)
    2. Your lack of understanding on the link between climate change and livestock farming is quite staggering. You seem to be under the impression that the climate change link is solely because of ruminants belching methane out their backsides?
    You are selectively ignoring myriad other factors;
    – the huge amount of fossil fuel used to produce fertiliser & pesticide for livestock farming
    – the massive loss of carbon sinks plus the carbon released by felling woodland for grazing
    – the ecological destruction caused by monocultures to feed livestock
    – 70% of soy globally is grown solely to feed livestock. Removing these emissions would lead to a massive reduction in global Greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions. (unless you believe 150 years of science, repeated countless times in the lab, and confirmed by spectral satellites in the atmosphere that carbon causes warming of the planet is also a big porky – in which case I regret wasting my time to help you).

    The numbers are simple. Livestock farming accounts for around 10% of UK GHG emissions (maybe as high as 15%), and ruminants account for over 60% of that total.

    Your misunderstanding of climate change also needs addressing. It is now 99% of the scientific community that agree climate change is human induced. To believe otherwise is equivalent to claiming the earth is flat or we don’t experience gravity. The ‘doubt’ you feel is simply driven by misinformation disseminated by the fossil fuel lobby.

    Climate change being caused by humans has statistical significance of 5 sigma, the equivalent to the chances of the science being wrong placed at around 1 in several million.

    If you still ‘doubt this’, I offer you the opportunity to put forward an alternative explanation that is more statistically likely than an explanation with a chance of being wrong of 1 in several million.

    This is the same statistical significance as CERN finding the Higgs boson. When we all celebrated that, when Peter Higgs popped champagne and shed a tear, did you say, ‘yeah I doubt that. In fact I doubt we even experience mass!’. Because this is the same level of argument you are making.

    In regards to your silliness on muscle, I can’t even begin to point out the numerous mistakes in your argument. I will simply offer this:
    – Novak Djokavic – 16 slams – VEGAN
    – Lewis Hamilton – 5 x World Championships – VEGAN
    – Venus Williams 7 slams – VEGAN
    – Tia Blanco – 2 x World Surf Championships – VEGAN
    – Defoe – all round good egg (sorry) and 7th highest scorer in prem history – VEGAN
    – There are countless vegan fighters (Nate Diaz, David Haye), runners, Hannah Teter multi-olympic medallist, weightlifters and many other elite sportspeople who would argue with your ‘online science’. None of these people seem to be falling over because their lack of muscle from animal protein is a detriment to them.

    If you don’t want to give up meat that is 100% your choice. I doubt the vegans on the high street were there trying to specifically convert you, so crack on.
    But ‘cautioning’ people and telling them to do ‘proper research’, whilst making frankly ludicrous claims based I assume on a few youtube videos that you’ve watched is incredibly unhelpful.

    Lastly, conflating a tax on meat with more people using foodbanks is amazingly disingenuous. People are using foodbanks in record numbers because successive governments have driven social injustice through the roof whilst giving tax breaks to millionaires. This is fact. Over 30% of children live in food poverty in many UK cities, all without an existing meat tax! This is a result of a system designed to funnel wealth upwards, ignoring homelessness, child poverty, racial inequality. Blaming poverty on vegans is a stretch beyond ridiculousness.

    I hope that helps a little, I genuinely am not trying to attack you, but people writing things like you’ve written above is a result of massive misinformation campaigns primarily by the fossil fuel and tobacco lobbies, and it can’t go unanswered.

    Have a nice weekend. It may be useful to spend it outside in nature and away from the realm of youtube videos funded by lobbyists.
15. Valerie Thompson Reply

    August 20, 2019 at 9:39 am

    I don’t eat steak and chips because I agree, it’s not interesting. But lemon and herb stuffed sea-bass with homegrown veg is. So is game, chestnut and mushroom casserole. So is the finest long-hung beef roast with crispy Yorkshire puddings.

    If you want a varied and healthy diet you need balance, with meat and fish protein.